05 October 2006
I found this neat summary of how badly men come out of divorces from a law firm’s website, a must-read for anyone still wondering why more and more men are on a marriage strike. It relates to British divorce law incidentally, but obviously it’s still worth non-Brits having a read as family law in most Western countries are similar in practice, and identical in principle.
There’s nothing here that most of us guys didn’t already know of course, but it’s worth directing any clueless men about to get married, who don’t think divorce is “that bad”, to read through it. Let them know that if they marry, their chances of being divorced are at least 30% and possible 80%, depending on where they live. In fact, the more a man will lose in a divorce depending on the local divorce laws, the higher the chance his wife will file for divorce on a whim.
The author, Terry Hall, is obviously selling his services as a solicitor to help men in the case of divorce, and what’s most notable is that he is so pessimistic! Even at the end he admits that the best a man can do in a divorce is to try not to “make a bad situation worse.” Bearing in mind Mr Hall is advertising himself and his legal skills to divorcing men here, it truly shows how terrible divorce laws are stacked against men if, even in his own self-marketing, a divorce lawyer can’t help but admit to us men that, in the event of a divorce, we’re fucked, and the best a lawyer can do is try to reduce how fucked we are to a tolerable level.
There’s three pages, but here’s the highlights:
Men in particular often come out of the divorce process feeling aggrieved and embittered. A very common scenario is that the house is transferred to the wife’s sole name, the children live with the wife and the husband pays maintenance for the children until they leave full time education while at the same time losing meaningful contact with them. All too often the man feels he has lost everything under such circumstances – wife, home and children – and that what he has spent years building up has suddenly been snatched away from him.
It does not matter who divorced whom for what – that almost always has no impact whatever on the decision making process when it comes to resolving financial issues.
Say there is a husband and wife who live in a modest home together with two young children. There is a mortgage on the home and some equity. There are no other capital assets. The husband has paid the mortgage installments while the wife has remained at home to look after the children from the time they were born. At first glance the husband might expect the home to be sold and the proceeds divided equally between himself and his wife. That will almost never happen.
What happens in this case is that the Court will look at the “needs” of the parties and it will be found that the “need” of the wife and children to have a roof over their head will vastly outweigh the “need” of the husband to have some part of the capital which was tied up in the matrimonial home. Young children almost always remain with the mother and so the overwhelming likelihood is that a Court would order the matrimonial home to be transferred into the sole name of the wife. This is despite the fact that the husband may have made all the financial payments. The Courts regard the needs of the wife and children to be much more important in cases such as these.
The truth of the matter is that is very rarely practicable to put both the parties into the financial position they would have been in if the marriage had not come to an end. In the overwhelming majority of cases there is simply not enough money available to enable both the husband and the wife to buy themselves suitable alternative accommodation and so a choice has to be made as to who has the greatest “need”. It is almost invariably the case that the Courts put the needs of the wife and children before that of the husband. This can seem, and is, very hard to the man.
[As an example] a father does not think his wife should have custody of the children because she has committed adultery. In his eyes she is “an unfit mother” or, alternatively, she should not have custody of the children because she does not deserve it after what she has done. This reasoning is bound to fail. An adulterous mother (or father) can still be a caring parent and adultery as such usually has hardly any impact upon what is in the child’s best interests so far as residence is concerned.
[A] legally aided litigant [nearly always the wife] can pursue litigation without being at any real risk of paying the costs of the other side if the litigation is unsuccessful. This rule is almost certainly only in existence to save the public purse but it places the husband facing a legally aided wife or ex-wife who is completely unreasonable in her demands at a huge disadvantage. Everyone involved in the system knows this and it encourages unreasonable demands by legally aided litigants such as many wives in matrimonial proceedings.
It is quite wrong but the financial consequences for the husband can be very serious indeed. Once again the scales are not evenly balanced because if the non-legally aided husband loses the case because it is adjudged that his proposals to settle were unsatisfactory the wife’s lawyers will ask for, and almost certainly get, an order that the husband pay the Legal Aid Board’s costs. This situation happens time after time in the courts and it is not surprising that many men rail at the injustice of it all.
The sad thing is, I feel that even if I sent that link to all those women who regularly denounce me as ‘cynical’ and ‘sad’ for not getting married, they would still demand to know why I refuse to ever marry, profess to have no idea what my problem was, and hurl further accusations of being cynical and sad.
I can’t imagine how depressing it must be for a guy being divorced by his wife to be told all of that by his solicitor, that he can expect everything to be taken away from him.
Oh, and bear in mind that, increasingly in the West, the above will apply to men if they split up with a live-in girlfriend.
Any man who reads that, understands it, but still wants to get married, is beyond saving.
Marriage and co-habitation; just say NO!
posted by Duncan Idaho @ 6:26 PM
At 7:00 PM, pete said…
How do they justify giving free legal aid to women, but not to men? Has there ever been an occasion where a woman has had to hire an attorney and pay legal fees out of her own pocket?
How wonderful for women – they get everything. While the man is lucky to leave with the shirt on his back.
At 7:08 PM, Beanns37 said…
What I find ironic is that you are unmarriageable; I wonder if this is what lies behind your stance on marriage and your anger towards women in general. And please do keep in mind that I am not pro-marriage per se and in fact will most likely not get married for a second time; on the other hand, I do not hate men as you seem to hate women. Thank you for sparing us… yourself. Bravo.
At 7:16 PM, Duncan Idaho said…
So what you’re saying, beanns37, is that you wouldn’t want to marry me?
Oh noooo! How awful. :(
Try to say something original. Trust me, we’ve heard all the shaming language, accusations of being angry with women and you-can’t-get-a-girlfriend comments before.
At 7:54 PM, Anonymous said…
beanns37’s shaming language is laughable. Do women still expect that to phase us?
Throughout history, marriage has been a good but not great deal for men (excluding monarchies and marriages for political reasons). Even before feminism, a husband was still a wage slave however he had the benefit of getting a home cooked meal, clean house, sex (which was considered a wifely duty back then) and someone to raise his children. So although it wasn’t a great deal, it wasn’t a bad deal either for a man to get married.
With the advent of feminism and divorce laws, marriage has turned into a major liability for men. So dangerous that it should be on the list which includes smoking, drinking, and trans fats as things one should avoid. Today, the norm for a husband is to expect disrespect, continuous insults, and outrageous demands and expectations from his wife with little to no gratitude for his contributions to the marriage. Should he divorce he loses 1/2 his assets, the house, custody of his kids, etc. Combine all these factors with the typical entitlement mentality of the women today and it doesn’t take a genius to see its a dangrous combination.
Marriage in its current state is deplorable and has absolutely nothing to offer men. The problem is too many men out there think their woman isn’t like that, won’t disrespect them, etc. The greatest complaint I get from my married friends is that their wives’ personalities change after marriage. This makes complete sense since the marriage and divorce laws of today do not put any restraint on a woman’s behavior. If you cheat and she divorces you, she gets 1/2. If she cheats and you divorce her, she still gets 1/2. With parameters like this what prevents a woman’s behavior from spiraling out of control? Marriage should be avoided like the plague.
At 8:05 PM, Anonymous said…
Personally i find it all tragic. I have been screwed financially in my divorce and had a 3 year expensive battle in the courts just to obtain alternate weekends.
My last girlfriend wanted to settle down and have children. I would have loved too but my survival instinct kicked in. If it happened again, i would not be able to afford a roof over my head and would in effect lose the relationship with my child from the first marriage.
It’s a lottery and if you can afford to lose, good luck. If you can’t afford to lose, don’t buy a ticket.
I have been honest and open with my ex-girlfriend and hope she will find a man to settle down with and have children.
I don’t hate women, i hate what happens when things go wrong.
At 8:12 PM, Captain Zarmband said…
The lawyer forgot to mention that your ex will also help herself to half your pension. You will also find that any and all of the joint debts (bank loans, overdrafts) will be dropped in the man’s lap and he will have to pay them off.
Marriage and divorce is a legal and financial con trick waged on men. Women are mercilessly greedy and self-centred. If you’re a man you will ignore these warnings at your peril. You may think that your beloved is different, I can assure you that women are all the same, grasping, greedy and manipulative. They also have all the feminist-inspired legislation on their side. My advice? Don’t get married….don’t let her move in. You will regret it.
At 8:56 PM, unpleasant bitter git said…
I see your blog is called “Monkeecats inner sanctum” and talk about cats crops up quite a bit on it.
Another cat herder, what a surprise!
At 8:57 PM, pete said…
What I find ironic is that a 38 year old career woman is calling a man in his 20’s unmarriagable.
Yeah baby, you go girl!! Ms. Barren von Infertile.
At 9:04 PM, Davout said…
Perhaps you can let every bachelor know what a divorced woman’s secret to ‘marriageability’ is?
At 9:18 PM, Anonymous said…
What’s the problem? Stay single. Let women call you a loser or a woman hater. They know the deck is stacked in their favor. Of course they are going to say those things. What do you expect? It will not last though. All the courts care about is money. When the worm turns the courts will go after them next. What goes around comes around. Stay single and stay out of court.
At 9:27 PM, Anonymous said…
Good to hear that from you, I know whom not to marry. Despite the horrible treatment of men in divorce you still demand of Duncan Idaho to marry.
Do you think before you write something?
Duncan and many would like to have a caring wife, well educated kids and a happy marriage.
But marriage today is a racket. An women are the racketeers.
Despite women wish constantly to be regarded as strong, they are still treated in court as if they were in need of protection. As a consequence men are plundered.
It is everywhere the same, GB is not an exception. When the incentives for divorce are high, divorce rates go up.
At 9:41 PM, byrdeye said…
What beanns37 is saying is that she is a failed mother, failed wife and failed woman…all at the ripe age of 38. Most likely a 5, tops. And $20 that her dress size is double-digit, too.
And of course she doesn’t hate men – because what’s there to hate? More than likely, she has dissed nice guy after nice guy of her own free will. As a woman, she is over-privileged and over-entitled by us in society and lives her life on a silver platter. No matter how bad she screws up, us men will always be there to prop her back up. So, what’s not to like?
WOMEN GOT IT THE BEST IN OUR MATRIARX TODAY! That’s why so many men hate women, but women just loooove us chumps! Makes perfect sense! Deeuuurrr!
But, who cares what she thinks? She’s old, fugly, fugged-up & plain doesn’t matter.
At 2:30 AM, HAWKEYE said…
and i bet she lives in a house that she stole from a man and lives off the public purse,but hey thats independence for a wymon
At 3:12 AM, Anonymous said…
And yet most men still spend most of their time chasing after women. I have a friend that is constantly whining that he is depressed because he doesn’t have a gf, and is appalled when I tell him I have no intention of getting married, or even having a serious gf.
If men insist on being stupid, I’m going to have to support these laws. I have no intention of supporting my own sex, if they’re just going to turn around and insult me for being intelligent.
At 3:43 AM, Mamonaku187 said…
That article is at once the scariest, most infuriating, and the saddest couple of paragraphs ever.
All Men have the duty to spread the word as far and as wide as we possibly can.
Until divorce laws change, there is no point in getting married in the West.
At 9:14 AM, Anonymous said…
My Father is happily married (never divorced) and sometimes jokes about how if my Mother left him she’d take everything. Last year, I decided to have a chat with him about the current state of divorce laws. He hadn’t realised just how bad they had become, and at the end of the conversation he commented that “there’s no incentive to get married these days. It’s not worth it.”
Ever since that conversation with my Dad, I can see the desperation of women who complain that “men should grow up and not be scared of commitment”.
Interestingly, I’m not alone. One of my friends recently visited his parents and was surprised when they brought up the subject of marriage. The funny part is that they both advised him _not_ to get married (Again both parents are happily married, never divorced). He said that the most surprising part was that his Dad knew all about the current divorce laws. Near the end of conversation, his parents asked if he was okay with not having children (they were fine with it). Of course, my friend has no intention of getting married or having children.
Something is very wrong when parents are advising their sons not to get married and not to have children.
At 5:46 PM, Paul Parmenter said…
The lawyer’s article is a must-read for every man thinking of marriage. In fact it is a must-read for every man, period. It can stand as a historic document that will tell future generations the tale of our times. Thanks for the link Duncan.
What it tells us is that the divorce laws and the way they are interpreted are corrupt, evil and rotten to the core. A poisonous recipe for destroying men, depriving children of their fathers, and encouraging women to behave abominably towards both.
The sooner this festering heap of injustice is swept away into the dustbin of history, the better. And it can take a whole shower of loathsome individuals, who live off it, with them. I include the greedy lawyers, the soulless judges, the serial incompetents of the CSA, the useless politicians who set it all up, and the despicable wives who grab, grab, grab because the system rewards them for doing so.
No wonder men are in revolt. They are fully justified.
At 7:02 PM, Brazilian Bachelor said…
We don’t hate women. Ironically enough, we are just sad that we can’t love one without being played.
Now go get some other shaming argument.
At 6:44 AM, Masculist Man said…
When somebody trashes you over and over again you certainly don’t love that person and if you did you certainly wouldn’t be worth the respect of men.
At 8:40 AM, Mark Mountjoy said…
Around August 31, 2006 I started working for the State of Colorado. Not even a good month passed before one of my co-workers lost his 30 year old nephew to suicide. Tonight he told me that the nephew and the wife knew one another since they were 15–when they started dating. But just recently she asked for a divorce and had started seeing another man. So when he saw that all his efforts were getting ready to go for real he got a rifle, had someone show him how to use it, and blew his brains out. His funeral was yesterday. At the age of 46 I own a female Bull Mastiff–and that is the only female I’ll live with. (I have my own horror stories that I need not detain you with).
At 10:11 AM, mfsob said…
Yeah, what Mark Mountjoy said – IF the government in the US gave a damn about men’s health, and could be bothered to do a study, I suspect they’d find that the suicide rate among men in their mid-30s to mid-40s has gone up exponentially in the last couple of decades … but then, it’s just useless men blowing their brains out, and according to the feminazis we don’t matter.
At 5:27 PM, Anonymous said…
A recent analysis of Marriages to Foreign Women in the US Reveals the following. US Marriages to Foreign Women in 1999 5,000 or there abouts. In 2005 37,500 Marriages to Foreign Women. US Feminists are horrified to find US Men saying No to Marriage to US Women.
This trend will only accelerate. Face it Ladies. You are being outsourced. More and More US Men are going overseas. Tired of their treatment. To our Brothers in the UK,Canada,Kiwis, and Aussie Men find a decent Foreign Wife. We can kill Feminism. Western Women must understand their hatred of Men means they need to become Lesbians. This is the logical progression to Western Feminism. And let them die alone, childless.
Western Women must feel the pain of their hatred towards their Men. We will see more and more desperate Cougars looking for younger Men to exploit. These are the true fruits of Feminism in the West.